[Samba] Friendly Reminder: Would you please comment on my findings?

awl1 awl1 at mnet-online.de
Fri Aug 18 13:06:48 UTC 2017

Hi again, Alain,

as Jeremy and Rowland advised to strip down my smb.conf as much as 
possible, I haven't yet tried with "hide unreadable = no".

Do you indeed mean to say that setting "hide unreadable = no" on the 
Samba *server* might indeed cause a difference in the way the Windows 
*client* sends its SMB2_FIND_ID_BOTH_DIRECTORY_INFO commands? This would 
mean that client and server would have to previously explicitly 
negotiate about the fact whether the server should hide unreadable files 
("hide unreadable"), and make the Windows client decide to send a 
different client-side SMB2_FIND_* command with less performance penalty 
in case the server does not need to hide any files!?

Nevertheless, I will try to set "hide unreadable = no" and report back 
later tonight if I see any changes...

Many thanks so far & best regards

Am 18.08.2017 um 14:50 schrieb Alain Deleglise:
> I have read some of your previous e-mails.
> I told you that because we suffered the same strange situation, 
> upgrading from samba 3.X to 4.X.
> Finally, did you, in your many attempts, try to copy those large 
> amounts of small files with "hide unreadable = no" or not, just to be 
> sure ?
> ArchitecteInfrastructure
> Responsable Avant-Vente Lille
> alter way <http://www.alterway.fr/>@alterway.fr 
> <https://twitter.com/alterway>
> T +33 1 41 16 83 42 - M +33 6 83 68 90 86
> EuraTechnologies, 166 bis avenue de Bretagne, 59000 LILLE
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> 2017-08-18 14:42 GMT+02:00 awl1 <awl1 at mnet-online.de 
> <mailto:awl1 at mnet-online.de>>:
>     Hi Alain,
>     many thanks for responding! :-)
>     Unfortunately, it's not that easy: In my case, the performance
>     difference/regression between SMB1 and SMB2/3 is unrelated to any
>     smb.conf settings, and even unrelated to Samba versions. It looks
>     like Microsoft has introduced a performance bug with the way that
>     their Windows SMB2/3 clients handle files with many entries, and
>     this performance hit becomes excessively apparent once you try to
>     copy a huge number of small files - please see the Wireshark SMBx
>     packet analysis here:
>     https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209749.html
>     <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209749.html>
>     https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209750.html
>     <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209750.html>
>     https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209751.html
>     <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209751.html>
>     for the details of how the Windows 10 client sends completely
>     inefficient SMB2/3 commands in to to list the files in the current
>     directory. I'm basically looking for confirmation that my
>     assessment is correct, and especially for help when addressing
>     this issue to Microsoft...
>     Thanks anyway & best regards
>     Andreas
>     Am 18.08.2017 um 14:07 schrieb Alain Deleglise via samba:
>         Hi Andreas, Maybe somtehing you already tried but, just in
>         case : try commenting "hide unreadable" or set it to "no".
>         Regards, Alain DELEGLISE Architecte Infrastructure Responsable
>         Avant-Vente Lille alter way <http://www.alterway.fr/>
>         @alterway.fr <http://alterway.fr>
>         <https://twitter.com/alterway> EuraTechnologies, 166 bis
>         avenue de Bretagne, 59000 LILLE 2017-08-18 12:51 GMT+02:00
>         awl1 via samba <samba at lists.samba.org
>         <mailto:samba at lists.samba.org>>:
>             Hello one more time, unfortunately, one more time, another
>             two weeks have passed without any reaction from neither
>             Jeremy in person nor the Samba team/community. I am quite
>             a bit astonished, disappointed and negatively surprised
>             indeed: Did I do anything wrong when raising my issue with
>             you? Everybody else asking questions or raising issues on
>             this list seems to receive great advice, while I no longer
>             get any reactions at all... Is my issue (a huge
>             performance regression when copying a large number of
>             small files both from and to a share with SMB2/3 as
>             compared to SMB1 using a Windows 10 client) too
>             technical/complicated (can hardly believe that), too hard
>             to understand, or simply (for whatever else reasons)
>             otherwise not welcome!? Note that - as requested by Jeremy
>             on July 14th: "Look into it some more (I'm a bit busy with
>             other stuff right now)." - I think have successfully
>             tracked down the performance regression to at least one
>             major root cause, which is a client-side issue in
>             SMB2/SMB3 on the Windows platform - see my several posts
>             on this list dated July 15th:
>             https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209749.html
>             <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209749.html>
>             https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209750.html
>             <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209750.html>
>             https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209751.html
>             <https://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2017-July/209751.html>
>             So basically at this point this analysis seems mostly done
>             and I am "only" waiting for Jeremy and/or the Samba team
>             to look into my assessment and provide your feedback: a)
>             Do you think that my analysis as laid out in this full
>             thread, particularly the posts referenced above, is valid?
>             b) In case you think it is, how can we proceed in terms of
>             making Microsoft aware of their performance regression? As
>             I feel that it would be much more likely to be successful,
>             I would like the Samba team to raise this issue with your
>             Microsoft contacts, rather than me as a private end
>             customer (there's no company backing me with regards to
>             this) complaining about this (which will only have a very
>             low chance of success)... Eagerly looking forward to some
>             feedback and support from the Samba community... Many
>             thanks for your understanding and support and best regards
>             Andreas Am 04.08.2017 um 16:49 schrieb awl1:
>                 Hello again, Jeremy (and hello, fellow Samba experts -
>                 maybe someone of you can comment on this, too!?),
>                 please accept my apologies in case you are on vacation
>                 - otherwise in case you are still terribly busy,
>                 please at least reply very shortly stating when you
>                 will finally have some time to look into this issue
>                 and my findings... Sorry to still be such a pain in
>                 your neck(s), but another two weeks passed, and I
>                 still did not receive any feedback on my findings (and
>                 questions re making Microsoft aware of their issue in
>                 case my analysis is correct). Looking forward to your
>                 assessment and proposal on how to move forward... ;-)
>                 Thanks a million, best regards & have a great weekend
>                 Andreas Am 21.07.2017 um 15:56 schrieb awl1:
>                     Hello Jeremy, Am 14.07.2017 um 23:33 schrieb
>                     Jeremy Allison:
>                         Look into it some more (I'm a bit busy with
>                         other stuff right now).
>                     when will you be available again to look into my
>                     latest findings (see previous posts) and provide
>                     your feedback? If you can confirm that it is
>                     Microsoft to blame, what would you propose to
>                     raise this issue with them? Wouldn't this ideally
>                     be done by somebody from the Samba team rather
>                     than me? Many thanks & best regards Andreas
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